並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep45-2%E6%9C%88%E6%88%B0%E7%88%AD-3%E6%9C%88%E5%8D%87%E6%81%AF-%E4%BA%8C%E6%8A%8A%E5%88%80%E6%AE%BA%E5%82%B7%E5%85%A8%E7%90%83%E8%82%A1%E5%B8%82-%E7%82%BA%E4%BD%95%E6%8A%95%E4%BF%A1%E8%91%A3%E5%BA%A7%E8%AA%AA-5%E6%9C%88%E5%86%8D%E8%B2%B7%E8%82%A1%E6%81%90%E6%80%95%E4%BE%86%E4%B8%8D%E5%8F%8A-ft-%E6%96%B0%E5%85%89%E6%8A%95%E4%BF%A1%E8%91%A3%E4%BA%8B%E9%95%B7/id1590806478?i=1000551015423